Since the euro is such a hot issue again, you may like to take a look at http://www.eurocoins.co.uk/britain.html

Hot issue or not, these are the latest facts about the euro:

1. It's just about recovered all its lost value against the pound (euro = 71p) but has not yet recovered its initial value against the dollar (euro = 1.22 dollars)

2. The Treasury will shortly say that none of the fabled five economic tests has yet been met

3. Opposition to the euro in the U.K. is running at record levels

4. German unemployment continues to rise and is now over 4.5 million (11%); French unemployment is over 2.5 million and rising

5. Inward investment into the U.K. has significantly exceeded that into France and Germany in each of th past three years

6. The economic growth rate in the U.K is twice the eurozone average

7. It's now seven years since the government was forced bu eurosceptic campaigners to concede a referendum on the euro. The government still hasn't called one, er, because they couldn't win it

Tony, this is what I've read in The Independent today:

"Experts unite to tell Brown: don't delay over euro

The Chancellor, Gordon Brown, was confronted by the collective might of more than 300 of the world's most eminent economists yesterday, who told him to declare that the UK has passed the five economic tests which will place it on track to join the euro.

The economists, who include Paul Volcker, the former head of the US central bank, Stanley Fischer, a former IMF managing director, the Nobel laureate Professor Robert Mundell and Lord Kingsdown, made their declaration before Mr Brown's own announcement about the result of the five tests, expected within three weeks.

"With only days to go until the Government announces the results of [the] tests, it is clear that not only is the economic evidence overwhelmingly in favour of euro entry, so is the opinion of the economics profession," said Phillippe Legrain, chief economist of the lobby group Britain in Europe (BiE) group, which published the list of pro-euro economists.

The call is echoed by Martin Weale, head of the National Institute for Economic and Social Research think tank, who, in today's Independent, says membership of the euro would eliminate swings in exchange and interest rates. Mr Weale says: "Joining the euro area will provide a more stable environment and one in which the UK should be able to compete effectively with the other European economies."

[...]

"It should neither be made on short-term considerations based on foreign policy or based on other events that have happened this year," he said. "It should be made on a long-term assessment of the national economic interest."

Earlier this week BiE published a report commissioned from independent economists showing that the UK economy would suffer from postponement of entry."

I thought that this forum was for debating the pros and cons of metrication, not the euro or the EU or anything else.

It seems that some people aren't capable of seperating these different issues.

Personally, I'm pro-metric and anti-euro. Make of that what you will.

Conrad,

Laughed out loud at the reference to Martin Weale of the NISER.

Two years ago, the NISER commissioned an independent report on the euro, which they desperately hoped would comprehensively show that keeping the pound was bad for jobs. The independent report said, er, that joining the euro would make little difference one way or another to jobs [since then, of course, we have the proof that the euro is *bad* for jobs as we see the inexorable rise of unemployment in the eurozone to an average of around 10% whilst British unemployment stays around 5% - under one million].

Martin Weale 'spun' the independnet research in a press release as saying that 8 million jobs were at risk if we didn't join the euro immediately. (The BBC went on to enthusiastically promote this daft conclusion on its news bulletins).

The head of the independent organisation who carried out the research was predictably incandescent. He described this as 'Propaganda worthy of Goebbels'

Biggest laugh about that such unbiased site:

"Postage & Packing, Per Shipment:

UK: At buyer's risk £2 or
Fully Insured £5 (Usually by Royal Mail Special Delivery) "

....errr!

Laugh number 2:

"Experts unite to tell Brown: don't delay over euro"

I ABSOLUTELY LOVE those "experts say" headings, they always end up a fallacy!

Laugh number 3:

"Phillippe Legrain, chief economist of the lobby group Britain in Europe (BiE) group"

(have a word with Mr Blair about why he's embarrassed about *that* little group!)

Laugh number 4:

"the UK economy would suffer from postponement of entry"

Er? WTF? Someone must be talking about a different *PLANET* let alone got the country name wrong!

Laugh Number 5:

Looking at the "facts" from BiE and the stuff on that coin site reminded me that the web is such a wonderful "place". You could probably dig some stuff up about Europe and an Ayran race and how we're all united under one runestone - or something.

Keep 'em coming Conrad!

Engineer: I fully appreciate that one can be anti-euro and pro-metric.

You can also be anti-metric and pro-euro.

Some like using that brush with tar on it - I don't.

BTW - I am anti-EU, anti-"euro", pro-metric and pro-imperial. Now see if you can work THAT little one out!

"I thought this forum was about debating the pros and cons of metrication"

Well, if you were *smart* enough to read the text above the board before posting, you would have seen:

"You may raise any issue you wish, for instance: the ease of use of the two systems, the relevance of the European Union, history and culture, scientific/mathematical points, the role of bureaucracy, or comparisons to other campaigns, such as restoring the traditional (pre-1974) counties."

Oh well lets get stuck in then.

What do you think about restoring traditional counties then Matt?

"Laugh number 3:

"Phillippe Legrain, chief economist of the lobby group Britain in Europe (BiE) group"

(have a word with Mr Blair about why he's embarrassed about *that* little group!)"

Certainly. You establish a group then it causes you no end of problems!

Does anyone know a "Simon Buckby" (or it could be "Buckley", not sure which.

He's the nasty piece of work that runs (ran?) the BiE that caused people like Blair, Heseltine so much embarrasment.

I once saw him on TV wearing a shiny blue jacket with the EU flag all over it.

I'm surprised he didn't have a sign saying "kick me hard" stuck to his back too - self administered naturally!

Yes, I quite like Simon Buckby. He is still 'in power', as it were.

"What do you think about restoring traditional counties then Matt?"


Since I am not British, my opinion is not very valid, but I will tell you that I think they should be restored. The county boundaries as they were served well for hundreds of years, why should they be changed now? To save money? There are better ways of doing that. Government is a well known waster of money.

When you divide land a way that changes traditional lines people have always known, you have problems. Case in point? Africa divided by Europeans on their own convenience and completely differently from the way the natives would divide it.

Personally this issue doesn't bother me much, but it was rumoured that when they started changing them it was to fiddle the local elections.

I can believe that.