A recent visitor to The Ukraine informs me that many items there are sold in Ukraine by the 'pound' - written of course in the Illyrian (Russian) script. Like in France, the Ukrainean pound is half a kilo

Pounds in Ukraine
July 27 2004 at 10:54 PM Tony Bennett


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A recent visitor to The Ukraine informs me that many items there are sold in Ukraine by the 'pound' - written of course in the Illyrian (Russian) script. Like in France, the Ukrainean pound is half a kilo


metre:
Clutching straws again? I seem to remember imperialists ardently resisting the redefining of their beloved pound. And 500 g maketh no beloved pound.

Clutching at straws again?

Although Ukraine starts "uk" it is not *THE* UK.

Silly old man

Using "pound" as a word for half a kilo is still metric

They do the same in Germany and no doubt many other countries.

Theres nothing wrong with the word pound.

re (Andy): "There's nothing wrong with the word pound".


REPLY: Ah, but that's where you wrong. It will be illegal to display the word 'pound' in a British shop after 31 December 2009, still less will one be able to say what the price of your goods are per pound. It amounts, as the BWMA Forum Owner has said more than once on this board, to a ban on information. But then, those of us who know where the European Union is going are not in the least surprised by that.

Someone, somewhere (like the top brass in the European Union), does *not* like the word 'pound'

Regulations specifying what words can be used in advertising / shop pricing etc etc are nothing new and are there for the consumers benefit. To pretend it is some kind of breach of our freedom is absurd.

99% of people will soon realise that essentially a pound is half a kilo, and adapt without any problem. But if you want to be awkward and still buy a pound of something after 2010, you can still do so - as long as the seller knows how many grams make up a pound he will give you that amount.

<<
Regulations specifying what words can be used in advertising / shop pricing etc etc are nothing new and are there for the consumers benefit.
>>

Do you seriously think that prohibiting the units that have been used in the country in standardized form for several decades is in the consumer's benefit?

<<<<<Do you seriously think that prohibiting the units that have been used in the country in standardized form for several decades is in the consumer's benefit?>>>>>

It is in the consumers benefit for prices to be displayed in one standard form only.

Dual pricing causes confusion and is not a long-term solution so one set of units has to go.

BAck to the "one language" argument then.

(Where's my grey suit?)

Everytime a European says 'pound' to mean 500 thousandth of a kilogramme he admits that the kilo is too big.

Oh dear, oh dear, oh dear. Poor old yUKMA.

As Mr T. said in the 'A Team' "I pity the fool"

So if you buy 2 pounds of something, do you admit that the pound is too small?

I lost 2.5 pounds on the weekend.

There's food poisoning for you!

<<
It is in the consumers benefit for prices to be displayed in one standard form only.

Dual pricing causes confusion and is not a long-term solution so one set of units has to go.
>>

But was it in the interest of consumers to introduce the metric system in the first place?

And now that there are two systems, wouldn't it be in the consumers' interest to remove the one that they are less familiar with? (Assuming BWMA's polls are valid, that would be metric.)

<<<<But was it in the interest of consumers to introduce the metric system in the first place?>>>>

Looking at it as a single issue, maybe not, but indirectly there are many benefits. Sadly many people don't actually consider the reasons for the change, and are stubbornly resistant to any change however insignificant to their lives.

<<<<<And now that there are two systems, wouldn't it be in the consumers' interest to remove the one that they are less familiar with? (Assuming BWMA's polls are valid, that would be metric.)>>>>

Given that industry is virtually completely metric in the UK now, it would be madness to change back. You could say we are past the point of no return.

The consumer will become familiar with metric as soon as the old system is phased out. How long does it take you to get used to a new currency when you go on holiday? A few days? Thats all it will take to get used to the new measurements. Its that simple. You just have to take away the old ones first!

<<
Dual pricing causes confusion and is not a long-term solution so one set of units has to go.
>>

Dual pricing serves one purpose - to reassure the consumer that he is not being ripped off by the supplier. To this end the price that is being phased out should be much less prominent than the price that is being phased in. This makes it difficult for the consumer to subconciously use the old price. In this way he will soon get used to the new price and the changeover can be completed.

I would think that if one is used to the old units, he will look at them regardless of how small they are. Even if the new units are much more prominent, they will not be noticed as long as the old units are present.

Exactly.
That is why dual pricing doesn't work if the aim is to get poeple used to the new system.

Bud wrote

<<
I would think that if one is used to the old units, he will look at them regardless of how small they are. Even if the new units are much more prominent, they will not be noticed as long as the old units are present.
>>

It depends on how much more prominent the new measures were than the old ones. Theoretically, petrol pumps in the UK are still dual priced - the litre price is in huge digits, visible form the road and appear again on the pump display. Attached to the pump is a sticker giving a conversion chart between price per litre and price per gallon. With recent inccreases in the price of petrol, I have seen some stickers that no longer cover the prices on display on the forecourt, but nobody cares - gallons are no longer used.

So are petrol pumps required to display the price per gallon, or simply display a conversion chart?

A converision chart.

The typical chart is about A6 size and is stuck on the pump.

Most garages use conversion charts, but I think the option to use equivalent gallon prices is still available to any garage which can be bothered.

Agree, however, that most conversion charts are out of date, but can anyone point out where it says that the conversion chart has to include the current litre price within it? I would be of the opinion that displaying any conversion chart would technically comply with the law.

I haven't checked the legislation in years, so correct me if I'm wrong....

I am not too sure what the law is at the moment, but in 2010 the use of supplementary units will be illegal, so the display of conversion charts might well be construed as being illegal. (Garage owners will probably welcome that change as it will be one less hassle for them to worry about).

2010 won't happen.

(well the actual year will, you know what i mean)

"I would think that if one is used to the old units, he will look at them regardless of how small they are"

One reason for Tesco making the imperial size bloody huge.

The odd market trader might slip through the net and get away with still displaying prices per lb, but you can be sure Tesco won't get away with it.

You obviously did not read my entire post

Yep I read it. They are currently exploiting some kind of loophole

After 2010 the situation will no longer be ambiguous.

After 2010

They are currently exploiting some kind of

ambiguous loophole

the situation will no longer be read

I 'Yep' it.

re (martin): "I am not too sure what the law is at the moment, but in 2010 the use of supplementary units will be illegal, so the display of conversion charts might well be construed as being illegal".

REPLY:

Extract from Department of Trade and Industry leaflet to be sent to all garage owners in July 2009:

"Please ensure that all your old conversion charts are completely removed from all petrol pumps from 31 December this year.

"In view of the fact that under the Weights and Measures (Find any Imperial Units, Stamp on them, Squash them, Burn them, Hang them, Do ANYTHING to them as long as you get rid of them completely) Regulations 2002, it will be illegal to display any information in Imperial units from one second past midnight on 31 December. You risk a fine of up to £5,000 at any time from one second past midnight on 31.12.2009 onwards if you are found to be in breach of these Regulations.

"A specially strengthened and sharpened 'Conversion Chart Scraper Off-er' is available, entirely free of charge (and with free gold-plated metric-only ruler), from your local Council, to help you in the swift removal and disposal of these soon-to-be illegal charts. Ask for the Imperial Obliteration Operative".

"Please ensure there are no old books or other written material lying around which may contain the word 'ga__on'. A customer or a Trading Standards Gauleiter might see one. If they see the word 'ga__on' anywhere on your premises you have broken the law.

"I respectfully refer you to the Imperial Measures (Search and Destroy) Regulations 2007, which come into force on the same day. You may get more information about these in our companion leaflet: "Let's Get it Over With" (with personally signed foreword by Lord Howe)".

___________________________________________________________
Publishd by the Department of Public Protection and printed by George Orwell Printers, 1984 Pound Lane, Six Mile Bottom, LB1 4OZ (Tel: 012 5280 2240).

haha, good one.


Would displaying price in gallons and a conversion chart to convert to litres also satisfy the law?

Bud
'Fraid not. The pump works in litres anyway. On most pumps, there are 3 digital dislays. These are 1) The volume delivered in litres 2) The price & 3) The price per litre.

I'm not aware of any demand for a 4th display to show price per gallon.

Tony
How long have spirits been sold in 25/35ml measures?

I am aware of many pubs in my area that have retained their old pewter 1/4 gill measures. One in particular, has a set ranging from a half-pint to 1/6 gill hanging on hooks around the bar. They look really good. They are bits of history. I know that they are never ever used (or they know when I'm about to visit and sprinkle them with dust).

As the law stands, a TSO can assume that any weighing or measuring equipment found on trade premises is in use for trade. As these measures are no longer prescribed, they are technically liable for seizure.

Have they been seized by any TSO that has visited since the spirit measure was changed to metric? Will they be seized in 2010? Stop scaremongering.

Interesting to see your style of naming regulations though. I shall look forward to the Weights and Measures (Find any Metric Units, Stamp on them, Squash them, Burn them, Hang them, Do ANYTHING to them as long as you get rid of them completely) Regulations and the Metric Measures (Search and Destroy) Regulations when the UKIP wins all 635 seats at the next election.

The paragraph above happening is about as likely as your proposed leaflet.

BTW The address/postcode thing was quite funny, but am I missing a joke with the phone no? Or am I trying to see a joke that isn't there?

re (Beranger): "BTW The address/postcode thing was quite funny, but am I missing a joke with the phone no? Or am I trying to see a joke that isn't there?"

ANSWER: Yes to the first question, no to the second:

12 inches in a foot

5280 feet in a mile

2240 lbs. in a ton

OK, you got me!
I should have spotted that (Obviously subconsciously I did or I wouldn't have asked!)
In my defence, the 012 threw me....

Gosh - I'm with you on that one B, ie I guessed the second two but the leading zero of the first one threw me

Steve
Are you laughing at me or with me there? Devil's Advocate....
BTW (and totally seriously) when is the big day for you and the soon to be Mrs H... Would happily send a daft wee present for the entertainment you've provided over the last few years....

"Would happily send a daft wee present "

Eurgh! I read that wrong!

Since I have tended to divulge most of my personal life then I might as well divulge more!

The aforesaid lady is "not realising what she's let herself in for" on October the 16th after which I'll send off my application form to "Fathers for Justice" - just incase.

Then we're off to three countries.

The first is mainly imperial
The second is almost entirely imperial
The third is half and half

Not coming to Scotland then! Tourist board aren't doing their job properly. Will get present together. Contact you later re where to send to.

re (SteveH): "Then we're off to three countries. The first is mainly imperial. The second is almost entirely imperial. The third is half and half"

REPLY:

1. A West Indian Island
2. United States
3. Canada

Good guess Tony, but not quite right!

It's:

1) York (UK)

2) Bahamas (WI)

3) Barbados (WI)

Heh!

Berenger, I was actually going to go to Scotland to start with.

You see, we have two days between wedding and Bahamas flight.

I decided to go to York since that's just a 3 hour train trip away.

I still need to go to Scotland though, as I've never been there.

I also want to go to the Isle of Man.

Anyone been there?

On Isle of Man for a daytrip once, but only 11 at the time so don't remember much except huge promenade & I think they still had trams.

There are big metal things with wings that get to Scotland from London in less than an hour. If you happened to come on a city break, make sure it's to Edinburgh. For get away from it all, follow Tony to the Hebridies.

It's been damp for August this year though....

<<There are big metal things with wings that get to Scotland from London in less than an hour.>>

Cheeky! Yeah I know that...

But the thought of flying there on Sunday and flying back on monday left me with the thought that I won't be able to do much in just one day.

With York I'll get to the heart of York by 5.30pm Sunday, get lashed, go out and about in york on Monday, jump on the train at 7.30pm and be back in the house before 10:30. Then its up again the next morning for the 9.20am flight to Bahamas.

See why I deferred Scotland for now?

So you recommend E'burgh over Glasgow?

Bet you love it when americans say "edinn - burrow" !!!

<<There are big metal things with wings that get to Scotland from London in less than an hour.>>

Cheeky! Yeah I know that...

But the thought of flying there on Sunday and flying back on monday left me with the thought that I won't be able to do much in just one day.

With York I'll get to the heart of York by 5.30pm Sunday, get lashed, go out and about in york on Monday, jump on the train at 7.30pm and be back in the house before 10:30. Then its up again the next morning for the 9.20am flight to Bahamas.

See why I deferred Scotland for now?

So you recommend E'burgh over Glasgow?

Bet you love it when americans say "edinn - burrow" !!!

Nothing wrong with Glasgow, but Edinburgh has the better touristy stuff.

Before the Claymores (NFL Europe) (Yes, it's played in imperial before you ask) moved to Hampden, they played at our national rugby stadium.

This allowed the Americans to introduce every show with "Welcome to Murray Field, Edinburrow for todays match......"

Try saying it out loud with a US accent for extra annoyance.

At the risk of annoying Bryan, NFL had right idea about London Monarchs - didn't perform so replaced by a German franchise!