I suppose there's some practical application for this technology. A clean burning fuel is only as clean as the energy it takes to produce it. If we moved foward with greater resources into solar technology research, the need for any sort of 'flame' powered device would become obsolete.
skeptical that this story has any truth to it. There was a fellow in the 1940's that claimed he could turn water into a fuel. Apparently he do so for the USN and then disappeared.
Is in not true that almost everything can be made to burn(rapidly oixidize) under the right conditions?
If it's only the massive bonbardment of radio waves that keeps the saltwater reaction going, then it's use as a fuel would be criminally inefficient. I suspect this is just a lot of hype so this guy can get some more funding to continue trying to build his anti-cancer machine.
that some electro-magnetic force or gamma rays or something like that could cause the bonds between hydrogen and oxygen in a water molecule to release hydrogen and ignite.
But how much power is required to do that and how much power would be returned in a form that could be used to operate a steam or internal combusion engine? I expect the ratio of power in to power out is much higher than 1/1.
Perhaps this guy just stumbled onto some variation of electrolysis which has been known for many years.
it wasn't possible only that I am skeptical. Because this same scam was played before. I think that if you electrolyze salt water you get chlorine gas too. Any such machine will always be less than unity.
I think you are right about the chlorine. I seem to recall that ships with brass propellers and drive shafts have a problem with electrolysis as well, but I do not know the chemistry of it. Perhaps it is the chlorine that eats away the brass parts.
they employ sacrificial anodes to prevent ships that are mothballed from corroding. It's some valance thing that I sort of remember from a book on transducers. You try to balance an applied voltage to counter the valance difference in the metal so that one doesn't electroplate away (Electroplating was another thing I tried besides electrolysis when I was a kid).
I remember doing copper plating experiments when I was a kid. I believe we used copper sulphate for that ut I forget the other details of the experiment. I presume we used a battery for a dc supply.
Cavitation:
1. disturbance of liquid: the rapid formation and collapse of bubbles in a liquid, caused by the movement of something in the liquid such as a propeller, or by waves of high-frequency sound
2. pitting of surface: the pitting of a solid surface as a result of the forces of repeated cavitation in a surrounding liquid
3. formation of cavities in tissue: the formation of cavities in body tissue, caused by a disease, e.g. as an effect of tuberculosis
I had to look up the word. I had heard it before in connection with boats but I had misunderstood the meaning. I thought it meant that a boat would lean slightly because of the high speed turning of the propeller. Maybe that is part of it anyway if a lot of bubbles are created under the boat.
A few years ago some teenager drowned near a water fall that was very foamy. The great number of bubbles made the water lighter in weight and he was unable to rise to the surface. Do not dive into a swiming pool of beer unless you can drink yourself back to the top.
Mmm... sounds like you're thinking of galvanic action - two dissimilar metals in electrical contact immersed in an electrolyte solution (i.e., seawater). Current flows from the metal that is lower in the galvanic series to the higher; the lower one corrodes in the process. Smaller vessels use sacrificial anodes (typically zinc, as that is the lowest on the galvanic series, if I remember aright) at strategic locations on the hull and in intake bays. Larger vessels tend to use impressed current systems (impose a current on the hull of equal potential and opposite polarity to the galvanic current flow). Not sure of all the possibilities; just the ones for naval vessels. Unfortunately those manuals are classified. Anyone with a bit of research skill should be able to work out the probable potential range, though.
Turns out the machine is being reviewed. It produces RF so that the salt water breaks down into hydrogen, oxygen sodium and chlorine. I don't expect much as this is just a fancy electrolysis of water.
Hey everyone... it's my first post. Steven Novella, MD (President of the NESS) dealt with this machine on the podcast - Skeptics Guide to the Universe. Essentially, the news reporters were credulous when reporting this fluff news piece. No one was calculating the amount of energy going into the system (in the form of microwave radiation). Therefore, the total energy output of this machine is at a substantial loss due to heat.
This is not the "a machine that could help solve the gasoline and energy crisis plaguing the U.S." ...unfortunately. I am sure any other questions can be sent to Dr. Novella (www.theness.com).
Ray,
Maybe I should have made myself more clear. Jay (me) sent the last post. I was referencing Steven Novella from the Skeptics Guide to the Universe, since he podcasted about this several weeks ago. Steven Novella is the President of the New England Skeptical Society (and I don't think he has ever posted on this board).
-Jay
Oculus Innovative Sciences, Pasadena (Forbes 2/28/05) is marketing Microcyn they say is a stabilized ionic water antiseptic "good for healing hard-to-heal wounds". It's made by electrolysing water.
You can buy stock in this turkey, which had an IPO and is listed. This makes me octothorpic (#&$#*#!).
I revisited a site I think is still run by Steve Lower. Oculus isn't mentioned (yet) but he told me in a private email that he thinks they probably get an effect from the chlorine residual.