(Login Lennyjoe) Members from IP address 96.239.145.183
I know this is a Clevo forum but thought I'd ask anyway. I need to rebuild/replace my engine in my 95 Bronco due to its age, loss of power etc. I can get ahold of a 69 mustang 302 for $150 with reconditioned heads. The lower half will need to be rebuilt. I'd like to build that for the Bronco. Nothing high performance, just good power down low for off roading.
Any ideas on what to expect with the age difference in the motor? Might I run into electronic issues with the computer and such?
Thanks for the info in advance. I'm so used to working on engines with a carb, distributer and that's about it. Don't like all the computer, emmisions and other crap if you can't tell by now...
Basically the main difference will be the lack of a crank sensor in the rear of the block, externally.
Internally, the piston ring size is about it, aside from the lack of the provisions for the hydraulic rollercam bracketry.
Make sure and use the correct water pump for your application!
Back in the day, the water pump ran in the direction of the crank rotation...that was changed for the serpentine belt, so now it spins "backwards". BTW, it WILL run hot if you install the wrong one.
Finally, you will notice the 4 bolt damper. you may need to use the one off your current engine, along with the flexplate, as the 69 should have come with a 3 bolt damper...and a different "factory balance".
Back in the day, Ford used a 28oz. imbalance for their dampers/flywheels...
today, its 50oz. imbalance.
The engine shouldnt care which you use, so long as you use both ends the same.
Give it a little time, and the experts will come along and correct this for you, but here's something to get you started.
Hope that helps.
Duke
Newer has Roller cam and the lifter bores are a little taller to aid support for the roller lifter. It has a 1 piece rear main seal, lacks the threaded boss for clutch linkage, 50 ounce balance conpared to 28 for the old. These are some of the differences I am aware of, plus the serpentine belt and water pump stuff mentioned.
Another minor difference is that older 302 blocks are a thicker and stronger casting. I would personally build a new block with a roller cam and single piece rear main seal. No worries about dead lifters with modern crap oil. I also think the single piece rear seals work a little better.
prior to 1970 they were 35,000 psi tensile strength (G35)
October 11 2008, 4:33 PM
some time in the early 70's , maybe 1970 itself , they switched to 32,000 psi tensile strength cast iron (G32). Later on they may have cheapened them even further I don't know.
so the newer ones might not be that thin afterall...
I don't know if his settles anything or adds to the confusion. I for one wish I could punch my 351C .125!
Didn't know about the water pump and dampner/flex plate. I don't know if the fuel injection manifold would bolt up, how the computer might respond to a torquier (sp) cam and possible increase in compression between the old and new motor. No plans on doing anything other than decent valves and a better cam. Other than that, the lower half will be all stock pistons, etc.
Miller Mylan (Login 417strokers) Members 70.77.16.209
Poor quality blocks
October 11 2008, 9:35 PM
The Blocks between 1974 and 1982 were not the best of quality . ford improved the blocks when they started raising the power of the 302 Ho eneine .I know of a few guys that split the casting on these blocks .When the blocks were improved they were better than the mid 70's blocks but not any better than the early blocks . Ford thought these super duper 135 horse power engines couldnt brake and egg. A later or early engine is ok the mid 70 's and early 80's blocks were Junk . 74 - 77 400 and 351 M blocks were garbage as well if your building one of them you want a truck Block.
lawrence coppola (Login L.A.racing) Members 58.160.138.182
Re: Poor quality blocks
October 12 2008, 2:33 AM
HAY!! that late model 5.0 50oz damper and flex plate/flywheel WILL NOT WORK AS IT IS. early 302s or any 351c 351w as they are all 28oz c/w.the counter wieghts of the crank are bigger on the 28oz motors. so if you swap them, and don't re balance the motor it will vibrate!!!
DaveMcLain (Login DaveMcLain) Members 69.132.164.178
Interchangeable
October 12 2008, 2:35 PM
From what I've seen there are no real differences in strength/material thickness in any of the regular production 302 blocks. They are ALL rather flimsy with not much material in the main webbing. For a reasonable build they are all just fine. I did a 331 stroker for a customer with a 70 Torino a year or two ago and I used a 5.0 block with the roller cam tappet bores and one piece seal, no problem. It worked fine. I did have to plug the dipstick hole in the pan rail because we were using a front sump pan but that was about all. It worked fine with a flat tappet hydraulic cam too.